It appears that you are a big enthusiast of The Lord Of The Rings.

John Rhys-Davies : What lies can I tell you ? Since early on I've placed my head on the log for this project. Only two weeks after arriving in New Zealand, I was saying that we were doing a masterpiece. And I saw that people didn't quite understand what was going on. A movie done in New Zealand that possibly will become one of the biggest movies ever made. When you see the 3 movies together, you will understand that this New Zealand's director, Peter Jackson, has done a masterpiece. I think it will be bigger than Star Wars.

How did you happen upon the project ?

JR-D : I didn't want to play Gimli. Even after accepting the part, I was concerned with the idea of committing myself for at least 14 months. Then, with the additional footage, it ended up to be two and a half years of my life. The numbers of 'two and a half years' I have left aren't that many anymore. Unless you're a young star like Liv Tyler or Tom Cruise, you only get to see a good script once every ten years. The rest of the time what an actor does is surviving. Some times we work on something that doesn't live up to the expectations, that don't go as well as we wish, that were very promising, but failed. Some times we do horrible things. To be in one big project happens only once every ten years. After what I did in the Indiana Jones movies, this is my next ten years' project.

Why did you trust Peter Jackson ?

JR-D : I saw the movies he had done. They were good movies. But there is a big difference, in terms of ambition and dimension, between The Frighteners and The Lord Of The Rings, in three parts, with a budget of $270 million. I went to New Zealand, that wasn't exactly known for being the world capital of cinema, thinking about what sort of amateur production I would be facing. I spent the first two weeks looking at the costumes, the weapons, the models, the drawings. Just in the other day, somebody told me that, if all the architectural and engineering plans were to be placed side by side, they would stretch for 15 km, which is a good indicator of the scale of what was being done. I was amazed, because I found things that I had never seen being done in LA, London or Rome, the world capitals of cinema.

Right from the start, did you notice any sort of support from the New Zealand authorities to this enormous project ?

JR-D : What Peter Jackson did was to create a film industry in New Zealand to serve this movie. It's very important to trust the director who is directing you. Many ask to be trusted, but then ask us to do only what we've always done. After two days, watching Peter Jackson direct, I realized that this man was truly an amazing filmmaker. He has everything a great director needs : he uses the full range of colors in the palette; he has a strategic view of things and large organization ability. He doesn't stop until he gets what he wants, but he doesn't get upset while he doesn't get it. He has an endless patience. Everyone can direct a movie and unfortunately, that's what they do. But to direct a good movie, in a short amount of time, that demands a good professional. Like directing episodes for TV. Many directors have 75 to 85% of what it takes to be a good director. Peter Jackson has it all. He knows the difference between tactic and strategy. Many directors are tactical, but very few are strategic.

The cast for this project was also very carefully picked, don't you think ?

JR-D : I walked in to a room, and I had just finished reading the book for the first time. I looked at the group of young actors I had in front of me and I realized at once who would be playing this or that part. And I got it right with all of them. First time in more than 30 years of career that I managed to do that. If the director picks his cast well, 80% of the actors' work is done. The rest is just telling actors where to place themselves and little more. I tried in every department to justify my initial idea that this was going to be a complete waste of time, but Peter Jackson totally convinced me. This guy is a Tolkien fan.

Twenty years after Raiders of the Lost Arch, you're in The Lord Of The Rings trilogy. Can you make a comparison between these two projects, in terms of evolution of special effects and directing styles ?

JR-D : George Lucas faced a film industry that was unable to produce the effects that he'd imagined to tell his stories. So, he put a part of his career on the side and dedicated himself to the creation of those effects, with Industrial Light & Magic. George Lucas was fundamental for the first Indiana Jones, with the money he invested in the movie. And he was there always. In the last four years, special effects have evolved deeply. But just because you can do something, people rush to do it, without thinking about the story. Five years ago, it was unthinkable to do Lord Of The Rings, because the technology wouldn't allow it. This is one of those moments in which the technology is here now, to be in the service of this great story. My oldest son told me that, I might not realize it, but in the past 45 years, bookshops all over the world have two shelves reserved for Tolkien's books. From there you can understand the popularity of these books. We all have our favorite novels, but for a novel to be this universal... Only now has the technology been set in march. But this isn't a movie about special effects, even though every shot of the movie is worked digitally. For example, when Antonioni filmed Blow-Up in Green Park, and told that it was a movie about a photographer examining reality, to see what was there, he looked at the grass and, as it wasn't green enough, he had it paint over. But this isn't a movie about special effects.

How would you define it then ?

JR-D : I think it's a movie about Good and Evil. It's about Tolkien's experience as a soldier in WWWI and his son as a soldier in WWWII. It's about a group of people that have to leave to defend the world they know from being destroyed and ruled by Evil. You can say it has a certain modernness about it to modern day viewers. I believe that this generation is living in a great time, because we have to make choices, about what we want and about what we believe, and we must accept that those choices have consequences. Times like these show the best there is in people. The worst too, obviously, but I think we're lucky to be living in a time like this.

You said that it wasn't Gimli whom you wanted to play.

JR-D : I wanted to be a part of what could possibly be a good movie. There was another character that I wanted to play. I think that it's actually not even in the movie. But there was also another character that I could play. I was horrified when Peter Jackson told me that he wanted me to play a dwarf. Look at me. I'm anything but a dwarf, up and sideways. An actor spends his entire life trying to be recognized. I spent 30 hard years of my life, to now have my face covered with silicone and my, already big nose, enlarged ? And my size shrunken ? If you knew the horror it was to go through all of that make-up procedure. Whole days in it, more than a year of your life. At first it would take 7 hours, then they started to be able to do it in less time, three hours and a half by the end. But that wasn't the end of it. If we shot before lunch, I was called to be re-touched. Forty minutes more. But then they would decide that we couldn't shoot before lunch. After lunch, there I was another hour and a half in the make-up chair. Because the make-up had to be perfect. If anything wasn't done right, the illusion was shattered and I would look like an actor in make-up. And by the end of the day, it was another hour just to get all of that off. I knew this would happen, that was why I didn't wanted to do this part.

Did all the actors have to go through the same ?

JR-D : Obviously all the supporting actors who played Orcs and Uruk-Hai had to go through it. But all of them were doing different things, so they didn't necessarily have to be with the same make-up all the time. And most of the times what they had on were masks. Only the teeth and things like that could take one or two hours to put. It was a process that involved a lot of people. If you see me doing any other part that requires make-up, you'll know that I'm being very well paid. Because after three hours it was such an itch... But you couldn't scratch it. Then it would itch some place else. The eyes would start swelling, and I would lose the skin around my eyes. Sometimes, the doctors told me that I couldn't work for two or three days, until I was over it. And then the torture would start all over again.

Did you ever think about quitting ?

JR-D : Never. The real pleasure of an actor is to be in the film location with other actors. We spent such good moments with each other. The idea that actors are jealous, competitive and stuff like that, I never witnessed that. Specially the oldest actors, those who have been around for 15 or 20 years. They were all so thankful to the fact that they have survived that they welcome their colleagues. That's why it's so much fun to hang around the shooting location. But I was never there; I was always in the make-up room. They would shoot without me being there. I became paranoiac and anti-social. The last thing I wanted was to go to parties and see people. My consolation came when I found the perfect boat, and then I spent a lot of time fishing. In New Zealand there are many opportunities to fish. To do a job like this again, I think not, but going back to New Zealand to work with Peter Jackson, if he asks me again ? I most certainly would.

Source : À conversa com os Senhores dos Anéis, by João Antunes.