Dol Goldur's hidden power...

[Ringwraith]

Hey guys, I need your insights here. :)

In the end of the chapter Lothlórien, from The Fellowship of the Ring, Haldir talks to Frodo and says:

(...) In the midst upon a stoney height stands Dol Goldur, where the long hidden Enemy had his dwelling. We fear that now it is inhabited again, and with power sevenfold. A black cloud lies often over it of late. In this high place, you may see the two powers that are opposed one to another; and ever they strive now in thought, but whereas the light perceives the very heart of the darkness, its own secret has not been discovered. (...)

What secret power is this? If it's seven times stronger than Sauron, who used to live in Dol Goldur, what would stop it from conquering all of Middle-earth?

Any answers?

[Algamesh]

RingWraith,

Just wanted to leave you a reply here and let you know that I'm working on this one. At the moment I'm a bit fuzzy on the details but I'll pick up the research later this afternoon.

Great Question!

[Orc]

In the midst upon a stoney height stands Dol Goldur, where the long hidden Enemy had his dwelling. We fear that now it is inhabited again, and with power sevenfold. A black cloud lies often over it of late. In this high place, you may see the two powers that are opposed one to another; and ever they strive now in thought, but whereas the light perceives the very heart of the darkness, its own secret has not been discovered.

OK, I'm going to take a stab at this one. I don't think that this is a seperate evil from Sauron, but simply an extension of it.

The "long hidden enemy" refers to Sauron himself, who took up residence there during the Third Age. Hidden refers to the fact that no one knew it was him. During the Hobbit, Gandalf leaves to deal with the 'Necromancer' or 'Litch King' (don't remember at the momement the correct name or term used) and later reveals that he found it to be Sauron himself.

"We fear that now it is inhabited again" probably refers to Sauron having been driven out by the Magi during the hobbit, and eventually one or two Nazgul re-occupy it.

"with power sevenfold" This could simply be a passing refrence to the growing power of Sauron himself, as he had been slowly reforming himself and amassing power since the beginning of the third age. I think UT mentioned something about one or two of the nazgul seting up a post here (possibly Kamul or the Whitchking), but don't see how this count's as 'sevenfold' power to Sauron.

"but whereas the light perceives the very heart of the darkness, its own secret has not been discovered" I think this may simply be a metaphore. Good is often associated with light, and evil with darkness. While ligth (as in produced by a torch or light bulb) can pierce darkness (i.e. night time), the LIGHT of GOOD cannot pierce the darkness of evil there, and thus no one knows what is going on inside Dol Guldor, rather than refering to a specific secret

[Catz]

i agree with you Orc...thats the way ive always read it......but to add to the bit at the end....
but whereas the light perceives the very heart of the darkness, its own secret has not been discovered.
this has to do with the ring......the powers of the Light ie: Galadriel, knows what is going on in Dol Goldur...her power has seen into the fortress, but Sauron, tho he is seeking, has not yet found her, or her ring, tho he strives to do so....Galadriel says as much in the book....thus her secret is safe for the moment
:catz:

[Daisy Gamgee]

I agree with that Catz, its not talking about the light being able to see the secrets of the dark, but the dark not being able to see the secrets of the light, ie the elven rings. "its own secret" refers to the elves not the secrets of Sauron.

[Aragorn Isildur]

It was Khamul i believe that occupied Dol Goldur during tWotr. I wonder if how far Dol Goldur's history stretches back....

Aragorn:king:

[Aragorn Isildur]

Juggernaut, is there a chance you could add something constructive?

Aragorn:king:

[Elendur]

I removed his post.. pretty soon he will not be adding anything at all.

Just a quick add... I think that Orc is mainly right. Sauron was basically sent to Dol Gurdur to garrison it by Morgoth a long time ago. He was familiar with the place and probably returned there to hide out, while re-growing his strength. He would not have wanted many people to become aware that he was there until such time as he percieved himself to be strong enough to take on his enemies. He was driven out by Gandalf and the white council, but now, with his evil growing he has returned, hence the greater sense of menace, which was probably hidden before. And the idea that Galadriel strove to limit the power of Sauron, while hiding the identity of her ring is always what I have read into this passage!:thumbs: